Doctor Who 4xit'snotreallytheendoftheseriesisit?

[jadesfire]

I haven't read my flist yet, mostly because I get the feeling I'd have to do skip=90million, and I need to sleep at some point tonight



I didn't love it. I enjoyed it, it was well written, nicely twisty, suitably peril-filled, but I find it hard to love season finales. "Parting of the Ways" sort of ruined me for any of them - to my mind, not even Doomsday lives up to the first season ender.

That said, it was an absolute blast and I'll happily watch it over and over in a way that I don't watch PotW (because Jack's face breaks my heart every time). It was a fantastic tie-up of all the loose ends, and I do love that all the plot threads meant something, from 'The Runaway Bride' onwards. The Ood name in particular was a really nice touch, and Catherine Tate was having waaaay too much fun with the technobabble. Oh, and I confess to waving at the screen and going "Dune! The Daleks are speaking German!" during that bit. What? I'm a linguistics geek. Languages excite me.

I really liked how they kept the characters very much themselves while they were all together - Sarah Jane's courage, Jackie and Mickey protecting Rose, Martha being the brave soldier the Doctor turned her into and Jack being...well, Jack. The scene at the end where they were all flying the TARDIS? Fangirl joy. Plus, a really nice Old Who reference. It was good that the Torchwood crew got a great Get Out Of Jail Free card, and I've loved that Tosh and Owen have been given mentions. Gone, but not forgotten. Alright, Gwen and Ianto didn't have much to do, and yes, The Mill were just showing off that they can do bullet time too, but that was great.

Breaking it down a little, it was a bit of a shame that none of the companions actually got to *do* anything useful. Rose in the budget-saving light-cage, the others transmatted out before they could actually do anything, and that was kind of my problem with the episode, I think. Yes, it was very cool to have them all their and doing their thing, but their things weren't things. They were time-fillers. Donna was the important one, which I have no problem whatsoever with, but we saw so little of her during most of the episode. I guess I'd just hoped that they would all be important, and Donna would be the key that unlocks the macguffin to save the day. Which she was, but with the Doctor rather than them, which for me, gave them a rather 'spare parts' feeling. I was happy to see them, don't get me wrong, and it was tremendous fun, but it's left me with that feeling you get after you eat aerosol cream (stay with me here) - It's nice and fluffy and great stuff, but afterwards, you kind of forget that you've eaten it because there's so little to it. I have a problem with the waste of characters.

Having said that, the stuff they were doing was highly entertaining - although seriously, guys, what's with Jack's clothes? Incinerator. Honestly. *points to icon* Nice set-up for Torchwood, though. And how excited was I to see Mickey? He still rocks. Martha was awesome. Charged with destroying the whole world, she delays but doesn't flinch. Like the Doctor, I can't help feeling it's a truly ludicrous idea, but I loved that Martha was willing to risk it. She's grown, hugely, and it's a joy.

One other thing that I thought was excellent was Davros' taunting of the Doctor. With the truth. From Donna's comment about Martha ("Is that what you did? You turned her into a soldier?") to the litany of deaths just in New Who, Davros has got a good point. And the Doctor knows it. I thought DT played that incredibly well, really spot on, the same as his expression at the very end. Wilf was wonderful as ever, and I liked that the Doctor seemed genuinely grateful for his promise. It felt right that there was no big splash-bang-wallop at the end, the way there have been over the last couple of years. For all that he went through, for all that happened, the quietness of the ending felt appropriate.

I liked what they did with Donna. She got her heroic end, then her tragic one, and Catherine Tate just slammed back anyone who criticised her acting. Because she made amnesiac!Donna cringeworthy and heartbreaking and spot on, just as she got DoctorDonna absolutely spot on. It was such a clever idea, and really nicely done. Plus, the technobabble was delightful. She owned the scenes she was in this whole episode, and absolutely deserved to. Donna Noble, how are you so awesome? Cheerio, love. We'll miss you.

And yes, I have left Rose out on purpose. *sigh* If ever a companion was underused in this... I'm sorry, I had a real problem with the ending. Because she obviously felt that the double was second best, and yet the Doctor leaves him with her. I also admit that my first thought on seeing that bit was "oh good grief, the fanfic". Rose and Nine were my favourite companion/Doctor combination (followed swiftly by Donna and Ten) but Rose and Ten never really did it for me. So maybe it's just because I don't see that one that it bothered me. Still, part of me felt so sorry for the human!Doctor, who surely is always going to be second-best to the real thing.

Jack wasn't as wasted as he could have been, and probably got the best line of the show ("Three Doctors!"...). I really, really could have done with more "Jack! Rose! Doctor Scott!". I know there are a lot of people on my friends-list who dislike Jack's immortality, but I love it, as a plot and character device. I like that he's willing to use it for a tactical advantage when he can, but that he just does it - no big, no fuss, just gets on and dies. And he doesn't do it for the sake of it. No heroics in Davros' vault, I noted. Of course, being me, I would have liked more screen time for him, but he got no more or less time than anyone else, so there's that at least.

As for the others? Well, they didn't really have much to do, so it's hard to say, except that I thought the character notes were lovely, the Doctor and Jackie prodding each other as usual, Sarah Jane being fantastic, and Mickey being generally brilliant. And yes, totally set up for Martha and Mickey to join Torchwood. I can live with that, just because it'll be a totally different chemistry, and could be a whole lot of fun.

I'm now trying to watch the tennis at the same time, and both Nadal and Federer are ripping my nerves to shreds, so I shall stop there and add more notes to other people's posts as I think of them. Overall, I enjoyed it, but won't be rushing to watch it again, or at least, I will be mostly looking out for vids with Jack from the last couple of episodes. Which probably makes me shallow, but happy.

Now we just have to wait and see what happens next...

Comments

[donutsweeper.livejournal.com]

Still, part of me felt so sorry for the human!Doctor, who surely is always going to be second-best to the real thing.

excellent, excellent point.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

I just found it really...weird. The whole dynamic felt odd, just off to me. And all I could think was 'fanfic hell'...

[miss-zedem.livejournal.com]

It probably says something that my absolute favourite thing was the German-speaking daleks...

The lack of use of the companions didn't bother me unduly, cos I was too busy being happy that Donna got a decent ending. Yes, it was gimmicky having them all there, but hey, it was RTD's last finale - I'd have done it if I were in his shoes.

I think I'm the only person who didn't mind the beach scene - Rose was sweet, but she was never my favourite companion, and if she's shallow enough to lock lips with someone who just looks like the man she loves, then *shrugs* that's up to her. Didn't upset me, didn't make me flail. But I did like the blocking very much - Donna and the Doc vs Jackie/Rose/new!Doc. Nicely reminiscent of s2.

I've had to stop watching the tennis, my nerves can't stand it! Two such evenly matched players - meep!

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

*giggle* Yup, I started bouncing at that point too.

I just...I understand it, I get it, but I would have preferred it if they'd all had a role in the end. I love that it was Donna's story, and I think I just would have rather seen it as a group effort backing her up than what we got. But this one may grow on me, perhaps.

I didn't notice that about the blocking - good point. I really wasn't bothered for Rose - as you say, her choice - it was more human!Doctor that I felt for. He's a whole new lifeform, and he just got...offloaded...was how it felt to me.

I saw the tennis through, although I hid behind the laptop for most of it - J looks shattered!

[unfeathered]

As usual, I agree with pretty much every word of this. :-)

It particularly bugs me too that none of the companions actually helped in the end, however much they tried.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

Hee. There are days I swear I can read my flists' minds... ;)

*nods* At least last season, Martha's wandering had a point, and they all got to join in on the 'clap your hands if you believe in Doctors' bit. In this, I was really disappointed that they just got to stand/kneel around. I wanted Donna to be as awesome as she was, but I really wanted the others to get some of it too.

Still, I'm thinking of them as character notes, showing us what the companions are like, and also showing what the Doctor is like. That helps.

[hllangel]

Nail-biting Who finale followed by Nail-biting tennis.

I need a vacation.

Jack got a much better deal in the finale this year than last. They seriously underused him last time. He got about three scenes. Which is a damn shame. As for Jack's indestructible clothing, it sucks. But he did get the best line in the entire thing, "I can't tell you what I'm thinking now." I literally squeeed and punched the air at that. THAT's the Jack we fell in love with from Empty Child.

Donna's end was heartbreaking.

Still not sure if Martha will join Torchwood, she has the opportunity to re-build Unit the way Jack did with Torchwood, and she'd be a fool not to take it. It also fits with rumors that they're setting her up to be the new Brig. As for Mickey on Torchwood, BRING IT ON. Though I'd love to see Martha in there, too. She makes Jack sparkle.

One of the best bits of the finale? Donna tearing Sarah Jane away from Jack to get her hug.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

Hee. It was kind of hard on the nerves, wasn't it? Both worth it, but oh boy.

Jack got a MUCH better deal out of this one - I always want more, but I'll settle for this.

My instinct on Martha is that they will have her join Torchwood, just to give her screentime, although whether it'll be as a sort of UNIT attache or as a fully-fledged team member, I'm not sure. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

Oh, I'd forgotten that moment - yes! Donna trying to get her hands on Jack was priceless :)

[aeshna_uk]

I really liked it - up there with PotW for me and far superior to the finales of the last two years. The various companions may not have ultimately had anything to do with the solution, but not for want of trying and I loved that they all had plans that they were completely prepared to use, regardless of cost. All far better than last year, where Jack was pretty much only there so they could explain how come he didn't become the focus for the resistance instead of Martha!

So, loved the various companion plans and their determination, loved the German!Daleks, loved Davros calling the Doctor on his bad habits (and quite correctly - the Doctor is all about the moral high ground, but he has much less right to it than pretty much anybody), and absolutely adored Dalek Caan and his giggly rebellion. Was insanely overjoyed by both Mickey and Jackie - Rose became a character who put my teeth on edge in s2 but I fell completely for those two and loved seeing them again. A shame we're losing Jackie, but she has a life and more family than just Rose in the AU, and keeping Mickey for TW is no bad thing at all. :) Loved Gwen in these and that Tosh saved the day, although Ianto did nothing to make himself any more interesting to me. One day I may get a grip on that character but today is not that day. LOVED Donna bodily shoving SJS aside so that she could get Jack to herself in the big hugfest. ;)

Donna's fate was tragic, but it rather needed to be - odd as it sounds, she'd earned something like that, that hits the viewer like a gut punch. It's terrible that she loses it all... but then, she doesn't know she's lost anything and she's gained the respect of a mother who's spent her life doing her down. CT has done a blinding job in the role and she'll be missed. This was high tragedy and far more effective and moving that Rose's fate in s2.

Speaking of whom.... I loved her in s1 and I wish they could have showed her moving on and not focusing everything on getting back to the Doctor. She started strong and turned into something clingy and pathetic... the exact opposite of Mickey's storyline, in fact. And now I have the sense that Rose should have been careful what she wished for - she has the Doctor, yes, but he's not the one she wants and never will be - he's just human, fragile and mortal and as trapped as she is. She'll never be happy, but and he's the one I feel sorry for, a free-wheeling near-immortal suddenly trapped in a world of consequences and mortgages. Still, at least he has Donna's attitude now and man, will that one come as a shock to Rose in their first lover's tiff!

I give it five years at most. ;)

(and Doctor, just exactly WHAT was the alternate option to wiping the Daleks out? Really? Get a bloody grip!)

The incinerator thing didn't even make me blink - the impression I got was that they put Jack in and he rolled out before it heated up and fried him. And I swear the coat is made of unstable molecules anyway, given the damage it regularly takes. ;)

How can anybody dislike Jack's immortality? :) It defines him and lets him develop and view the world in ways that he simply couldn't as a mortal. Jack isn't just about the here and now - the people he has around him are points in a continuum to him, just as much as any of the Doctor's companions, no more or less precious than those who came before or those who will come after. We're seeing him at a stage where he's pretty much come to terms with it and there's just so much fun to be had with that. And the writers use it well - Jack will use it tactically but not casually and it's not used as a freebie in every episode/book/audio. And while he may be unable to die, those around him manage it all too well, which is where the real meat of it is.

I'm really looking forward to Martha and Mickey on TW - that's going to be a fun dynamic, especially where Mickey is concerned as it'll give Jack someone else in the "soldier" role. There is an odd temptation to write something with Jack taking him down to the firing range to, er, check out his level of training. ;) But I think that one will just have to wait in line....

*ahem* Longer than I thought it would be. But basically, I liked it and I'm looking forward to the new dynamic on TW. :)

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

All far better than last year, where Jack was pretty much only there so they could explain how come he didn't become the focus for the resistance instead of Martha!
Oh yes, definitely. Thinking about it overnight, I'm much happier with this episode. I think I still prefer PotW, but this one could grow on me, because, as you say, they had a plan and they were prepared to use it. If I stop thinking so much about the plot and focus on the characters, I could definitely fall in love with this episode.

Rose became a character who put my teeth on edge in s2 but I fell completely for those two and loved seeing them again.
Yes! I fell in love with Rose in S1 and out of love in S2. This series reminded me why I liked her in the first place. So much better. Mickey and Jackie continue to rock, and remind me that I must read the Big Bang fic 'Idiot's Guide to Foiling Alien Invasions' which puts them in the limelight. They were awesome, and like you, I'd love to see Mickey in Torchwood. It'll shake the dynamic up completely, which should be fun to watch.

LOVED Donna bodily shoving SJS aside so that she could get Jack to herself in the big hugfest. ;)
I'd forgotten that, but it made me laugh out loud – like Donna's "Hug me. No, really, hug me." She's brilliant.

Donna's fate was tragic, but it rather needed to be - odd as it sounds, she'd earned something like that, that hits the viewer like a gut punch.
Couldn't agree more. It was the right ending for Donna, and the scene between the Doctor and her mother was fantastic. Those are the AU fics I want to read, where Donna discovers how awesome she is, even without the Doctor. Because she obviously has the potential – I really hope her mother and granddad help her realise it.

a free-wheeling near-immortal suddenly trapped in a world of consequences and mortgages. Still, at least he has Donna's attitude now and man, will that one come as a shock to Rose in their first lover's tiff!
Oh good grief, I hadn't thought of that. *mind boggles* Like you, I felt more for him than for her, because he effectively got offloaded onto her, like an unwanted child. No matter that being the Doctor, he probably wants her as much as she wants him, but it still felt too close to a rejection. I shall hold onto the thought of the squabbles to make me grin instead :)

(and Doctor, just exactly WHAT was the alternate option to wiping the Daleks out? Really? Get a bloody grip!)
I KNOW! Also, when Rose/the Bad Wolf wiped out the Daleks, you didn't bat an eyelid. Why is this now a big deal?

The incinerator thing didn't even make me blink - the impression I got was that they put Jack in and he rolled out before it heated up and fried him. And I swear the coat is made of unstable molecules anyway, given the damage it regularly takes. ;)
Both sound like perfectly reasonable explanations to me!

On Jack's immortality, I've seen people complain that it's too gimmicky and stops him from being interesting as a character. For me (as you) it's part of what makes him interesting as a character. It's not just about not being able to be killed on one particular occasion. It's the whole shebang and all the consequences that come from it. It was good to see him using it tactically, and starting to enjoy himself again. In the last series of Torchwood, I thought they did interesting things with it, and I hope they continue to do so.

There is an odd temptation to write something with Jack taking him down to the firing range to, er, check out his level of training.
*brain explodes*

[cybel]

Damn I've loved this season of DW! I hope they can keep up the quality under new leadership.

But, hey, I'm really here to let you know I posted a podbook of Going Home to amplificathon amd house_podfic. Hope you enjoy.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

I'm glad they've given themselves a bit of time to adjust before making the whole new series - hopefully they can produce the goods if they're given the time and space. *crosses fingers*

And thank you! I shall run over and have a look :D

[travels-in-time.livejournal.com]

In my head, 10.2 is angry at being deemed "too dangerous" and locked away with no TARDIS and only one life, and a girl who doesn't really want him...

And so we get the Valeyard. :D

(And also? He's "too dangerous" because he destroyed the Daleks. So the remedy to "fix" him is to put him in the care of the girl who...destroyed the Daleks. Okay. Someone [I can't remember who, or I'd credit] in our chat last night noted that RTD was wearing his logic-repelling vest for this one.

And we won't mention how the Doctor himself did his level best to destroy the Daleks, along with his own people...)

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

And so we get the Valeyard.
*giggle* Scary, scary thought. Brilliant.

The whole thing with 10a/10.2 bugged me, not for Rose's sake but for his. It wasn't his fault, he did the only thing possible under the circumstances, and then he gets booted off the crew for saving the whole universe. Nice.

[kribban.livejournal.com]

You liked what they did to Donna? Honestly, I would have prefered if he had chucked her into a black hole like I thought he was going to do when he pulled his "so so sorry-line."

I think it's the most cruel and depressing exit for a character I've ever seen. To stick her back in that life. Death would have been much more preferable.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

Well, I wasn't grinning with glee. I was mostly huddled on the sofa cuddling a small stuffed dog, and trying not to sob. But plot-wise, yes I did. Emotionally, it was a complete gut punch, and I have no problem with being gut punched on Donna's behalf.

Also, I didn't feel it was left without hope. No, she's not the Donna Noble who travelled with the Doctor, but she still has all that potential, and maybe now, she'll find it on her own terms, with her family's support. I refuse to believe that a Donna who managed all that with the Doctor's help is an incapable Donna without him. For me, the exchange between the Doctor and her mother was the most telling, and was gave me that hope. The Donna who can only shout at the world in "Turn Left" is a direct product of her mother's constant criticism. Without that? Who knows?

Also, she was a bit dim, shallow, oblivious, etc, but is her life really that awful? That it's worse than death? She can't feel the loss, because she doesn't remember it. We feel it on her behalf, but in that last phone call to her friend, she was happy. She was unhappy before 'Partners in Crime' because she knew what she was missing. Now, she doesn't, and maybe she has a shot at real happiness without the Doctor. For me, that's a way better fate than poor Rose and not!Doctor. That's the one that felt cruel to me.

[donutsweeper.livejournal.com]

Still, part of me felt so sorry for the human!Doctor, who surely is always going to be second-best to the real thing.

excellent, excellent point.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

I just found it really...weird. The whole dynamic felt odd, just off to me. And all I could think was 'fanfic hell'...

[miss-zedem.livejournal.com]

It probably says something that my absolute favourite thing was the German-speaking daleks...

The lack of use of the companions didn't bother me unduly, cos I was too busy being happy that Donna got a decent ending. Yes, it was gimmicky having them all there, but hey, it was RTD's last finale - I'd have done it if I were in his shoes.

I think I'm the only person who didn't mind the beach scene - Rose was sweet, but she was never my favourite companion, and if she's shallow enough to lock lips with someone who just looks like the man she loves, then *shrugs* that's up to her. Didn't upset me, didn't make me flail. But I did like the blocking very much - Donna and the Doc vs Jackie/Rose/new!Doc. Nicely reminiscent of s2.

I've had to stop watching the tennis, my nerves can't stand it! Two such evenly matched players - meep!

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

*giggle* Yup, I started bouncing at that point too.

I just...I understand it, I get it, but I would have preferred it if they'd all had a role in the end. I love that it was Donna's story, and I think I just would have rather seen it as a group effort backing her up than what we got. But this one may grow on me, perhaps.

I didn't notice that about the blocking - good point. I really wasn't bothered for Rose - as you say, her choice - it was more human!Doctor that I felt for. He's a whole new lifeform, and he just got...offloaded...was how it felt to me.

I saw the tennis through, although I hid behind the laptop for most of it - J looks shattered!

[unfeathered]

As usual, I agree with pretty much every word of this. :-)

It particularly bugs me too that none of the companions actually helped in the end, however much they tried.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

Hee. There are days I swear I can read my flists' minds... ;)

*nods* At least last season, Martha's wandering had a point, and they all got to join in on the 'clap your hands if you believe in Doctors' bit. In this, I was really disappointed that they just got to stand/kneel around. I wanted Donna to be as awesome as she was, but I really wanted the others to get some of it too.

Still, I'm thinking of them as character notes, showing us what the companions are like, and also showing what the Doctor is like. That helps.

[hllangel]

Nail-biting Who finale followed by Nail-biting tennis.

I need a vacation.

Jack got a much better deal in the finale this year than last. They seriously underused him last time. He got about three scenes. Which is a damn shame. As for Jack's indestructible clothing, it sucks. But he did get the best line in the entire thing, "I can't tell you what I'm thinking now." I literally squeeed and punched the air at that. THAT's the Jack we fell in love with from Empty Child.

Donna's end was heartbreaking.

Still not sure if Martha will join Torchwood, she has the opportunity to re-build Unit the way Jack did with Torchwood, and she'd be a fool not to take it. It also fits with rumors that they're setting her up to be the new Brig. As for Mickey on Torchwood, BRING IT ON. Though I'd love to see Martha in there, too. She makes Jack sparkle.

One of the best bits of the finale? Donna tearing Sarah Jane away from Jack to get her hug.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

Hee. It was kind of hard on the nerves, wasn't it? Both worth it, but oh boy.

Jack got a MUCH better deal out of this one - I always want more, but I'll settle for this.

My instinct on Martha is that they will have her join Torchwood, just to give her screentime, although whether it'll be as a sort of UNIT attache or as a fully-fledged team member, I'm not sure. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

Oh, I'd forgotten that moment - yes! Donna trying to get her hands on Jack was priceless :)

[aeshna_uk]

I really liked it - up there with PotW for me and far superior to the finales of the last two years. The various companions may not have ultimately had anything to do with the solution, but not for want of trying and I loved that they all had plans that they were completely prepared to use, regardless of cost. All far better than last year, where Jack was pretty much only there so they could explain how come he didn't become the focus for the resistance instead of Martha!

So, loved the various companion plans and their determination, loved the German!Daleks, loved Davros calling the Doctor on his bad habits (and quite correctly - the Doctor is all about the moral high ground, but he has much less right to it than pretty much anybody), and absolutely adored Dalek Caan and his giggly rebellion. Was insanely overjoyed by both Mickey and Jackie - Rose became a character who put my teeth on edge in s2 but I fell completely for those two and loved seeing them again. A shame we're losing Jackie, but she has a life and more family than just Rose in the AU, and keeping Mickey for TW is no bad thing at all. :) Loved Gwen in these and that Tosh saved the day, although Ianto did nothing to make himself any more interesting to me. One day I may get a grip on that character but today is not that day. LOVED Donna bodily shoving SJS aside so that she could get Jack to herself in the big hugfest. ;)

Donna's fate was tragic, but it rather needed to be - odd as it sounds, she'd earned something like that, that hits the viewer like a gut punch. It's terrible that she loses it all... but then, she doesn't know she's lost anything and she's gained the respect of a mother who's spent her life doing her down. CT has done a blinding job in the role and she'll be missed. This was high tragedy and far more effective and moving that Rose's fate in s2.

Speaking of whom.... I loved her in s1 and I wish they could have showed her moving on and not focusing everything on getting back to the Doctor. She started strong and turned into something clingy and pathetic... the exact opposite of Mickey's storyline, in fact. And now I have the sense that Rose should have been careful what she wished for - she has the Doctor, yes, but he's not the one she wants and never will be - he's just human, fragile and mortal and as trapped as she is. She'll never be happy, but and he's the one I feel sorry for, a free-wheeling near-immortal suddenly trapped in a world of consequences and mortgages. Still, at least he has Donna's attitude now and man, will that one come as a shock to Rose in their first lover's tiff!

I give it five years at most. ;)

(and Doctor, just exactly WHAT was the alternate option to wiping the Daleks out? Really? Get a bloody grip!)

The incinerator thing didn't even make me blink - the impression I got was that they put Jack in and he rolled out before it heated up and fried him. And I swear the coat is made of unstable molecules anyway, given the damage it regularly takes. ;)

How can anybody dislike Jack's immortality? :) It defines him and lets him develop and view the world in ways that he simply couldn't as a mortal. Jack isn't just about the here and now - the people he has around him are points in a continuum to him, just as much as any of the Doctor's companions, no more or less precious than those who came before or those who will come after. We're seeing him at a stage where he's pretty much come to terms with it and there's just so much fun to be had with that. And the writers use it well - Jack will use it tactically but not casually and it's not used as a freebie in every episode/book/audio. And while he may be unable to die, those around him manage it all too well, which is where the real meat of it is.

I'm really looking forward to Martha and Mickey on TW - that's going to be a fun dynamic, especially where Mickey is concerned as it'll give Jack someone else in the "soldier" role. There is an odd temptation to write something with Jack taking him down to the firing range to, er, check out his level of training. ;) But I think that one will just have to wait in line....

*ahem* Longer than I thought it would be. But basically, I liked it and I'm looking forward to the new dynamic on TW. :)

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

All far better than last year, where Jack was pretty much only there so they could explain how come he didn't become the focus for the resistance instead of Martha!
Oh yes, definitely. Thinking about it overnight, I'm much happier with this episode. I think I still prefer PotW, but this one could grow on me, because, as you say, they had a plan and they were prepared to use it. If I stop thinking so much about the plot and focus on the characters, I could definitely fall in love with this episode.

Rose became a character who put my teeth on edge in s2 but I fell completely for those two and loved seeing them again.
Yes! I fell in love with Rose in S1 and out of love in S2. This series reminded me why I liked her in the first place. So much better. Mickey and Jackie continue to rock, and remind me that I must read the Big Bang fic 'Idiot's Guide to Foiling Alien Invasions' which puts them in the limelight. They were awesome, and like you, I'd love to see Mickey in Torchwood. It'll shake the dynamic up completely, which should be fun to watch.

LOVED Donna bodily shoving SJS aside so that she could get Jack to herself in the big hugfest. ;)
I'd forgotten that, but it made me laugh out loud – like Donna's "Hug me. No, really, hug me." She's brilliant.

Donna's fate was tragic, but it rather needed to be - odd as it sounds, she'd earned something like that, that hits the viewer like a gut punch.
Couldn't agree more. It was the right ending for Donna, and the scene between the Doctor and her mother was fantastic. Those are the AU fics I want to read, where Donna discovers how awesome she is, even without the Doctor. Because she obviously has the potential – I really hope her mother and granddad help her realise it.

a free-wheeling near-immortal suddenly trapped in a world of consequences and mortgages. Still, at least he has Donna's attitude now and man, will that one come as a shock to Rose in their first lover's tiff!
Oh good grief, I hadn't thought of that. *mind boggles* Like you, I felt more for him than for her, because he effectively got offloaded onto her, like an unwanted child. No matter that being the Doctor, he probably wants her as much as she wants him, but it still felt too close to a rejection. I shall hold onto the thought of the squabbles to make me grin instead :)

(and Doctor, just exactly WHAT was the alternate option to wiping the Daleks out? Really? Get a bloody grip!)
I KNOW! Also, when Rose/the Bad Wolf wiped out the Daleks, you didn't bat an eyelid. Why is this now a big deal?

The incinerator thing didn't even make me blink - the impression I got was that they put Jack in and he rolled out before it heated up and fried him. And I swear the coat is made of unstable molecules anyway, given the damage it regularly takes. ;)
Both sound like perfectly reasonable explanations to me!

On Jack's immortality, I've seen people complain that it's too gimmicky and stops him from being interesting as a character. For me (as you) it's part of what makes him interesting as a character. It's not just about not being able to be killed on one particular occasion. It's the whole shebang and all the consequences that come from it. It was good to see him using it tactically, and starting to enjoy himself again. In the last series of Torchwood, I thought they did interesting things with it, and I hope they continue to do so.

There is an odd temptation to write something with Jack taking him down to the firing range to, er, check out his level of training.
*brain explodes*

[cybel]

Damn I've loved this season of DW! I hope they can keep up the quality under new leadership.

But, hey, I'm really here to let you know I posted a podbook of Going Home to amplificathon amd house_podfic. Hope you enjoy.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

I'm glad they've given themselves a bit of time to adjust before making the whole new series - hopefully they can produce the goods if they're given the time and space. *crosses fingers*

And thank you! I shall run over and have a look :D

[travels-in-time.livejournal.com]

In my head, 10.2 is angry at being deemed "too dangerous" and locked away with no TARDIS and only one life, and a girl who doesn't really want him...

And so we get the Valeyard. :D

(And also? He's "too dangerous" because he destroyed the Daleks. So the remedy to "fix" him is to put him in the care of the girl who...destroyed the Daleks. Okay. Someone [I can't remember who, or I'd credit] in our chat last night noted that RTD was wearing his logic-repelling vest for this one.

And we won't mention how the Doctor himself did his level best to destroy the Daleks, along with his own people...)

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

And so we get the Valeyard.
*giggle* Scary, scary thought. Brilliant.

The whole thing with 10a/10.2 bugged me, not for Rose's sake but for his. It wasn't his fault, he did the only thing possible under the circumstances, and then he gets booted off the crew for saving the whole universe. Nice.

[kribban.livejournal.com]

You liked what they did to Donna? Honestly, I would have prefered if he had chucked her into a black hole like I thought he was going to do when he pulled his "so so sorry-line."

I think it's the most cruel and depressing exit for a character I've ever seen. To stick her back in that life. Death would have been much more preferable.

[jadesfire2808.livejournal.com]

Well, I wasn't grinning with glee. I was mostly huddled on the sofa cuddling a small stuffed dog, and trying not to sob. But plot-wise, yes I did. Emotionally, it was a complete gut punch, and I have no problem with being gut punched on Donna's behalf.

Also, I didn't feel it was left without hope. No, she's not the Donna Noble who travelled with the Doctor, but she still has all that potential, and maybe now, she'll find it on her own terms, with her family's support. I refuse to believe that a Donna who managed all that with the Doctor's help is an incapable Donna without him. For me, the exchange between the Doctor and her mother was the most telling, and was gave me that hope. The Donna who can only shout at the world in "Turn Left" is a direct product of her mother's constant criticism. Without that? Who knows?

Also, she was a bit dim, shallow, oblivious, etc, but is her life really that awful? That it's worse than death? She can't feel the loss, because she doesn't remember it. We feel it on her behalf, but in that last phone call to her friend, she was happy. She was unhappy before 'Partners in Crime' because she knew what she was missing. Now, she doesn't, and maybe she has a shot at real happiness without the Doctor. For me, that's a way better fate than poor Rose and not!Doctor. That's the one that felt cruel to me.